The Foundation "Trilogy," by Isaac Asimov

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The Foundation "Trilogy," by Isaac Asimov

Postby Omphalos » Fri Jan 09, 2009 6:09 pm

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I have never been a very dedicated historian. I just do not have a memory for random names, dates, places and occurrences. I never did well in my history classes, and certainly do not read much on the subject today. But there is one area of history that I do really love, and what little reading I do is in that area. Individual people and what they do are important, but I am always fascinated by history books that address the movements of masses of people. I could care less about Custer, but I loved Bury My Heart at Wounded Knee. Tojo bores me to tears, but Bataan doesn’t. Stalin did too much evil for me to comprehend, but the Pogroms in the Urals capture my attention every time. There is too much on the History Channel about Hitler for me to get interested, but any story about the plight of the Jews and I’m there. Canadian history is not my cup of tea either, but give me a book on how and why the Arcadians left Nova Scotia and moved to Louisiana and I’m happy for a day or so. I think that may be part of why I have always loved Asimov's Foundation books. They resonate with epic movements of people and future histories of wars in a way that very few other SF books do. And I think that for that reason, the Foundation novels are pretty much required reading for any SF fan...Please click here, or on the book cover above, to be taken to the complete review..
Something is about to happen, Hal. Something wonderful!

-James C. Harwood, Science Fiction Writer, Straight (March 5, 1956 - May 25, 2010)



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Postby Freakzilla » Mon Jan 12, 2009 8:47 am

I say this is a must read for any SF fan. If you haven't read it, you're wrong! I too love how broad, sweeping currents of history can traced back to the actions of an idividual. The scale of the story is truley epic and that's one of the things I love in SF.

BTW, Omph, there used to be a show in THC called Connections you would have loved. I don't think they show it anymore but it was really good. The International History Channel is a little less Hitler-centric, I've been watching a lot of that.
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Postby Omphalos » Mon Jan 12, 2009 8:58 am

I don't think that I have the IHC. I only have basic cable.
Something is about to happen, Hal. Something wonderful!

-James C. Harwood, Science Fiction Writer, Straight (March 5, 1956 - May 25, 2010)



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Postby Freakzilla » Mon Jan 12, 2009 9:24 am

Omphalos wrote:I don't think that I have the IHC. I only have basic cable.


For me it's on the next package up from basic. The selling point (for my wife) is about six extra childrens channels but I enjoy it for the Military Channel, Science Channel and IHC. Plus we get the Encore (old) movie channels. I'd be hurting to go back to basic. It was only about $10 more for me.
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Postby Omphalos » Mon Jan 12, 2009 10:07 am

I keep trying to get the finance minister (wife) to approve an upgrade. No go.
Something is about to happen, Hal. Something wonderful!

-James C. Harwood, Science Fiction Writer, Straight (March 5, 1956 - May 25, 2010)



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Postby The Phantom » Mon Jan 12, 2009 10:28 am

Freakzilla wrote:I say this is a must read for any SF fan. If you haven't read it, you're wrong! I too love how broad, sweeping currents of history can traced back to the actions of an idividual. The scale of the story is truley epic and that's one of the things I love in SF.


I personally loved how they tied back the origins of psychohistory to daneel and giskard. I love both the robot and foundation series so it was very cool to see that connection. sure he had to retcon some dates and time periods for it, but he's allowed to do that with his own series.

I'm just finishing up robots and empire right now and other than some tangential books like nemesis and end of eternity, I don't have any books within that universe left in the pile.
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Postby Freakzilla » Mon Jan 12, 2009 10:45 am

I thought the connection between the Robots and Foundation books was kind of a stretch but like you said, it's his universe. I still enjoyed it.
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Postby The Phantom » Mon Jan 12, 2009 11:03 am

Freakzilla wrote:I thought the connection between the Robots and Foundation books was kind of a stretch but like you said, it's his universe. I still enjoyed it.


i just like how he had the last few volumes of foundation dealing with the old spacer worlds that you get to know in the robot series and then the big reveal about giskard at the end was really neat. I felt he didn't change anything about either universe unnecessarily and it was a easy connection. of course i just got into asimov this year so for some who had read his series before the connection was made it may have a different impact.
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Postby SandRider » Mon Jan 12, 2009 1:20 pm

Omphalos wrote:I keep trying to get the finance minister (wife) to approve an upgrade. No go.


stage a coup & nationalise the bank (accounts).
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Postby Omphalos » Mon Jan 12, 2009 2:13 pm

SandRider wrote:
Omphalos wrote:I keep trying to get the finance minister (wife) to approve an upgrade. No go.


stage a coup & nationalise the bank (accounts).


The troops are on her side. Its a non-starter no matter how crafty or devious I am. The best I can get away with is black-market activity and the occasional "shadow-project."
Something is about to happen, Hal. Something wonderful!

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Postby Omphalos » Mon Jan 12, 2009 2:15 pm

Baraka Bryan wrote:I personally loved how they tied back the origins of psychohistory to daneel and giskard.


That is why Byron once said something along the lines of "the ending is a shocker! You're gonna love it!" Because it was tacit approval for what his two uncles are doing.
Last edited by Omphalos on Mon Jan 12, 2009 2:16 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Postby Freakzilla » Mon Jan 12, 2009 2:16 pm

Omphalos wrote:
SandRider wrote:
Omphalos wrote:I keep trying to get the finance minister (wife) to approve an upgrade. No go.


stage a coup & nationalise the bank (accounts).


The troops are on her side. Its a non-starter no matter how crafty or devious I am. The best I can get away with is black-market activity and the occasional "shadow-project."


Occasionally I have to pay my parents back after using their gas card. Durring the price hike that could be an easy $80.

Then there's always cash-back at Kroger.

:wink:
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Postby The Phantom » Mon Jan 12, 2009 2:18 pm

Omphalos wrote:
Baraka Bryan wrote:I personally loved how they tied back the origins of psychohistory to daneel and giskard.


That is why Byron once said something along the lines of "the ending is a shocker! You're gonna love it!" Because it was tacit approval for what his two uncles are doing.



it's so sad that there are those parallels. the comparison is an insult to asimov's genius. both are authors in their own universes (mcduniverse being different than Duniverse of course) tying shit back to previous works...... the major difference is that in asimov's there is almost perfect continuity and consistency across the tens of thousands of years covered by all the books.
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Postby Freakzilla » Mon Jan 12, 2009 2:29 pm

Baraka Bryan wrote:
Omphalos wrote:
Baraka Bryan wrote:I personally loved how they tied back the origins of psychohistory to daneel and giskard.


That is why Byron once said something along the lines of "the ending is a shocker! You're gonna love it!" Because it was tacit approval for what his two uncles are doing.



it's so sad that there are those parallels. the comparison is an insult to asimov's genius. both are authors in their own universes (mcduniverse being different than Duniverse of course) tying shit back to previous works...... the major difference is that in asimov's there is almost perfect continuity and consistency across the tens of thousands of years covered by all the books.


I think the real difference is that the Foundation universe belonged to Asimov to fuck up as he pleased.
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Postby The Phantom » Mon Jan 12, 2009 2:30 pm

Freakzilla wrote:
Baraka Bryan wrote:
Omphalos wrote:
Baraka Bryan wrote:I personally loved how they tied back the origins of psychohistory to daneel and giskard.


That is why Byron once said something along the lines of "the ending is a shocker! You're gonna love it!" Because it was tacit approval for what his two uncles are doing.



it's so sad that there are those parallels. the comparison is an insult to asimov's genius. both are authors in their own universes (mcduniverse being different than Duniverse of course) tying shit back to previous works...... the major difference is that in asimov's there is almost perfect continuity and consistency across the tens of thousands of years covered by all the books.


I think the real difference is that the Foundation universe belonged to Asimov to fuck up as he pleased.


true. though the Mcduniverse is theirs to fuck with as well..... that is, if it's possible to get any worse.
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Postby Freakzilla » Mon Jan 12, 2009 2:48 pm

I meant that he was it's creator, not that he owned the copywrite.
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Postby The Phantom » Mon Jan 12, 2009 2:59 pm

Freakzilla wrote:I meant that he was it's creator, not that he owned the copywrite.



and they're the creators of a shitty parody of a genius series. all they're doing with continued writing is fucking up their own universe.... Dune will survive whatever they throw at it.
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Postby Freakzilla » Mon Jan 12, 2009 3:16 pm

This is the Tribulation for Dune fans.
They were destroyed because they lied pretentiously. Have no fear that my wrath
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Postby Omphalos » Mon Jan 12, 2009 3:26 pm

So why arent we disappearing, like in that book?
Something is about to happen, Hal. Something wonderful!

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Postby The Phantom » Mon Jan 12, 2009 3:41 pm

Omphalos wrote:So why arent we disappearing, like in that book?



ugh :vomit: to left behind.
not only is it a shitty read, it's based on a horrible misinterpretation of the Bible. doesn't matter if you believe in the Bible or not, trying to base on a story on something in it should be consistent with what it says.... Tim LaHaye and Jerry Jenkins are 'christian' writing's equivalent of KJA and bribri
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Postby Freakzilla » Mon Jan 12, 2009 3:49 pm

Omphalos wrote:So why arent we disappearing, like in that book?


We're obviously unsaved. :cry:

But if we remain faithfull through this Tribulation we will join FH in the air when he returns and Pinky & The Brian are devoured by His Beard.
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Postby Bubba » Mon Jan 12, 2009 3:59 pm

And in the meantime, we will be involved in lots of chaotic exploits where we attempt to strike out at the demons and the Interloper!!!

Yaa! Chaos!!!
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Postby SandChigger » Mon Jan 12, 2009 4:57 pm

Freakzilla wrote:...when he returns and Pinky & The Brian are devoured by His Beard.

Classic. :lol:
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Postby SandRider » Mon Jan 12, 2009 8:19 pm

Omphalos wrote:
SandRider wrote:
Omphalos wrote:I keep trying to get the finance minister (wife) to approve an upgrade. No go.


stage a coup & nationalise the bank (accounts).


The troops are on her side. Its a non-starter no matter how crafty or devious I am. The best I can get away with is black-market activity and the occasional "shadow-project."



It's called an "off-budget supplemental" now.
Like the entire Iraq war.
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Postby Freakzilla » Tue Jan 13, 2009 8:22 am

SandRider wrote:
Omphalos wrote:
SandRider wrote:
Omphalos wrote:I keep trying to get the finance minister (wife) to approve an upgrade. No go.


stage a coup & nationalise the bank (accounts).


The troops are on her side. Its a non-starter no matter how crafty or devious I am. The best I can get away with is black-market activity and the occasional "shadow-project."



It's called an "off-budget supplemental" now.
Like the entire Iraq war.


I'm sure you meant Operation Iraqi Freedom. :wink:
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Postby Seraphan » Tue Jan 13, 2009 10:00 am

Well, Omph, i read your review and it's settled, i'm buying this. :P
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Postby The Phantom » Tue Jan 13, 2009 10:02 am

Seraphan wrote:Well, Omph, i read your review and it's settled, i'm buying this. :P
good call. the SFBC has a decent 3-in-1 hardcover
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Postby GamePlayer » Tue Jan 13, 2009 10:07 am

I liked this series. It's a bit dry and procedural, but it's just so fascinating to see it play out. And even though it was old, I never saw the twist coming, so it really worked for me. I do like Asimov's Robot stories better, but Foundation was a lot of fun.
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Postby The Phantom » Tue Jan 13, 2009 10:59 am

GamePlayer wrote:I liked this series. It's a bit dry and procedural, but it's just so fascinating to see it play out. And even though it was old, I never saw the twist coming, so it really worked for me. I do like Asimov's Robot stories better, but Foundation was a lot of fun.


i find a lot of his books have similar plot progressions and always have the big twist at the end where all is revealed and is totally unexpected. the jury is still out for me on whether or not I prefer robots or foundation.... they're very different stories..
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Postby A Thing of Eternity » Tue Jan 13, 2009 11:00 am

I read this series in roughly chronological order (Prelude to Foundation first, then normal order... I did forward the foundation last though, which I think is the sequel to Prelude? Can't remember now) and it was pretty great.

I maybe should have read them in publishing order though.
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Postby The Phantom » Tue Jan 13, 2009 11:04 am

A Thing of Eternity wrote:I read this series in roughly chronological order (Prelude to Foundation first, then normal order... I did forward the foundation last though, which I think is the sequel to Prelude? Can't remember now) and it was pretty great.

I maybe should have read them in publishing order though.



i've been reading in publishing order within micro series... so all of foundation books in order, all empire in order, all robots in order.
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Postby Freakzilla » Tue Jan 13, 2009 11:20 am

^^^ I think published order is always best.

A Thing of Eternity wrote:I read this series in roughly chronological order (Prelude to Foundation first, then normal order... I did forward the foundation last though, which I think is the sequel to Prelude? Can't remember now) and it was pretty great.

I maybe should have read them in publishing order though.


PREEK! :x
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Postby SandRider » Tue Jan 13, 2009 11:36 am

This is kind of simplistic, and I haven't read the Foundation books in
many, many years, but the thing I remember most, the little detail that
has stuck with me forever is the title of the "First Speaker" being so
bestowed because that was the guy that always spoke first.

It's just a brilliant little thing, and maybe it was important to me
after reading Tolkien, and the way he constructed names, his
interest in the origin of names.
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Postby GamePlayer » Tue Jan 13, 2009 1:04 pm

Well, not every writer can be gifted with great dialog or interesting narrative structure. But Asimov did know how to write a story which was worthwhile because of the creative concepts and satisfying because of the great finale. I think that's why I like Asimov's Robot stories the most, especially I, Robot, because I felt his writing strengths were at their height in those books.

Growing up in an era of the exploited original and the pointless sequel/prequel, I have learned that "published chronology" is sacred :)
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Postby Freakzilla » Tue Jan 13, 2009 1:18 pm

I thought the story telling was a little better in the Robot Series.
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Postby Star Dust » Tue Jan 13, 2009 4:24 pm

I'd agree these are must reads, but i was disappointed with Foundation.
Conceptually I think he had a winner, but his prose didn't resonate with me.
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