Mimicry

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Mimicry

Postby Omphalos » Sat Dec 15, 2007 12:27 am

You know, Ive heard quite a few times that one of the reasons we should accept the new Dune books is because there is no way that anyone could ever have either imitated FH's style or even come close to his level of complexity. I suppose the notion there is that we should just accept the crap that was put out as the best that could have been done no matter what. I personally think that last bit is a bit of shit, as we have plenty of authors who were or are capable of that level of thought. But as to the former, I think that argument is a little bit stupid because BH and KJA were actually trying to copy Frank's style. I think that the best evidence of this is the epigraphs, what with them trying to sound learned from an in universe historical perspective. Hell, they even stole a few of FH's and threw them into their shit books (without proper credit in the front of the books, I might add :evil: ) in what appears to me to be a crafty attempt to add legitimacy to their own writing and to make the whole work come off sounding just like something FH would have written. If it only were that they both weren't so fucking stupid, it just might have worked.

Discuss.
Something is about to happen, Hal. Something wonderful!

-James C. Harwood, Science Fiction Writer, Straight (March 5, 1956 - May 25, 2010)



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Postby SandChigger » Sat Dec 15, 2007 3:09 am

I have finally fallen off the fence.

I don't think they're stupid anymore.

I think they're just plain evil. :twisted:
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Postby Omphalos » Sat Dec 15, 2007 3:21 am

Would you at least give me stupid and evil?
Something is about to happen, Hal. Something wonderful!

-James C. Harwood, Science Fiction Writer, Straight (March 5, 1956 - May 25, 2010)



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Postby SandChigger » Sat Dec 15, 2007 3:32 am

Mmmmm...not just yet.

To get "stupid" into the equation:

They think Dune fans are stupid. And therefore are doubly evil.

They are each evil individually and thus more evil in conjunction.

I would be amenable to "ignorant" over "stupid" at this juncture, based on the limited second-hand evidence I now have.

:D
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Postby Omphalos » Sat Dec 15, 2007 3:35 am

I guess I can buy some intelligence. But I wont give up on stupid. They have to be stupid if they think real fans will sign off on their massacre of Dune.
Something is about to happen, Hal. Something wonderful!

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Postby Freakzilla » Sat Dec 15, 2007 10:03 am

Intelligence and common sense have NOTHING to do with each other. :P
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Postby Phaedrus » Sat Dec 15, 2007 3:48 pm

Omphalos wrote:I guess I can buy some intelligence. But I wont give up on stupid. They have to be stupid if they think real fans will sign off on their massacre of Dune.


(Invoking Godwin's Law)

Hitler was intelligent to blame everything on the Jews and run with it. He was at risk for pissing off a minority, but a large majority then supported him. I think those bastards are doing the same. Ignore the inner fan-base, rely on casual Dune fans and Anderfans to help assure that the books will be New York Times Bestsellers.

Really, I don't know. Part of me wants to believe they're just evil, part of me thinks it's that they're stupid. I've been on this fence for a while.

I'm willing to settle for a compromise. The HLP is ignorant and/or stupid, but Anderson is just pure evil.
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Postby Tleilax Master B » Mon Dec 17, 2007 8:55 am

Phaedrus wrote:
Omphalos wrote:I guess I can buy some intelligence. But I wont give up on stupid. They have to be stupid if they think real fans will sign off on their massacre of Dune.


(Invoking Godwin's Law)

Hitler was intelligent to blame everything on the Jews and run with it. He was at risk for pissing off a minority, but a large majority then supported him. I think those bastards are doing the same. Ignore the inner fan-base, rely on casual Dune fans and Anderfans to help assure that the books will be New York Times Bestsellers.

Really, I don't know. Part of me wants to believe they're just evil, part of me thinks it's that they're stupid. I've been on this fence for a while.

I'm willing to settle for a compromise. The HLP is ignorant and/or stupid, but Anderson is just pure evil.


Difficult to say if this is ignorance, evil, stupidity. But one thing we can probably all agree on is that KJA is an ASSHOLE! A flaming, festering, arrogant asshole.
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Postby Omphalos » Mon Dec 17, 2007 3:52 pm

Id really like to see someone go to a talk at a convention and try to quiz him on his Dune knowledge. Im sure that he is too smart to allow himself to be caught like that, and its generally regarded to be in bad taste to try that sort of stunt at a con (I think), but Id still love to see someone like Freak put him in his place in public.
Something is about to happen, Hal. Something wonderful!

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Postby Freakzilla » Mon Dec 17, 2007 4:53 pm

Omphalos wrote:Id really like to see someone go to a talk at a convention and try to quiz him on his Dune knowledge. Im sure that he is too smart to allow himself to be caught like that, and its generally regarded to be in bad taste to try that sort of stunt at a con (I think), but Id still love to see someone like Freak put him in his place in public.


A while back I suggested a trivia contest between me and KJA&BH over at DN. I even said I wouldn't use my PDFs. I'd love to take them on.

The saddest thing though, its not the trivial inconcistancies that really bother me, its that they seem to have missed the very essence of what FH was trying to say, like their evil robot empire in the Legends and even the idea of a "Heroes of Dune" series.

They just make me want to vommit.
They were destroyed because they lied pretentiously. Have no fear that my wrath
will fall upon you because of your innocent mistakes.

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Postby Phaedrus » Tue Dec 18, 2007 3:40 pm

Freakzilla wrote:
Omphalos wrote:Id really like to see someone go to a talk at a convention and try to quiz him on his Dune knowledge. Im sure that he is too smart to allow himself to be caught like that, and its generally regarded to be in bad taste to try that sort of stunt at a con (I think), but Id still love to see someone like Freak put him in his place in public.


A while back I suggested a trivia contest between me and KJA&BH over at DN. I even said I wouldn't use my PDFs. I'd love to take them on.

The saddest thing though, its not the trivial inconcistancies that really bother me, its that they seem to have missed the very essence of what FH was trying to say, like their evil robot empire in the Legends and even the idea of a "Heroes of Dune" series.

They just make me want to vommit.


I say we should have a round robin trivia tournament, no one uses any books. All the OH's and anyone else who wants to play, Kevvy and Brian get to be on the same team, everyone else is singles play.

I bet other than maybe arnoldo and that annoying Martian guy, they'd come in last place. Unless Byron's moderating. :evil:
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Postby Freakzilla » Tue Dec 18, 2007 9:15 pm

They'd ask questions like "where was Paul born" (I think that was one of my fist in the DN trivia topic) and refer to FH's notes.

:roll:
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Postby Phaedrus » Tue Dec 18, 2007 9:41 pm

Freakzilla wrote:They'd ask questions like "where was Paul born" (I think that was one of my fist in the DN trivia topic) and refer to FH's notes.

:roll:

"Who was Jessica's mother?"

:wink:
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Postby SandChigger » Thu Dec 20, 2007 11:48 am

More important, WHO was Erasmus' tailor/dressmaker?! That black evening thang he's wearing on that one Trannies cover is FABULOUS!!!

:shock:

Um...erm...ahem.

OOH! SOMEONE'S HIJACKED MY ACCOUNT! :D
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Postby The Phantom » Wed Jan 23, 2008 8:24 am

and their attempts at epigraphs are such shit. half the time it's some pointless quote trying to sound philosophical by the character that the following chapter focuses on.
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Postby Nekhrun » Wed Jan 23, 2008 9:44 am

I did see that the Trivia thread on DN had a prequel question running through it now. :roll:
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Postby Freakzilla » Wed Jan 23, 2008 9:49 am

Nekhrun wrote:I did see that the Trivia thread on DN had a prequel question running through it now. :roll:


Asked by arnolodo and answered by Byron.

:roll:
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Postby Omphalos » Wed Jan 23, 2008 10:37 am

Its a shame he took down our "How do you spell D*U*N*E" line of questions there. Those were probably better than the current ones.
Something is about to happen, Hal. Something wonderful!

-James C. Harwood, Science Fiction Writer, Straight (March 5, 1956 - May 25, 2010)



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Postby SandChigger » Wed Jan 23, 2008 1:27 pm

I had a quick look around over there yesterday morning.

I noticed a thread (Dutch translation of Grunters or Sadworms?) where Serkanner had posted something about the translators taking so long because they were laughing too hard and Byron posted something like "Please stay on topic."

(Which is one reason why, in my now deleted comment in reply to her comment about "not valuing the spam in the preceding comments" I asked Her Highness The Regent if she were now following Byron's lead in her administrative style.)

I saw the "How do you spell..." comments, by the way. They WERE funny.
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Postby chanilover » Thu Jan 24, 2008 5:31 am

I loved those piss take questions ,especially -

After his death, why was Leto I not involved in Alia's upbringing? :lol:
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Postby Tleilax Master B » Thu Jan 24, 2008 4:32 pm

SandChigger wrote:I had a quick look around over there yesterday morning.

I noticed a thread (Dutch translation of Grunters or Sadworms?) where Serkanner had posted something about the translators taking so long because they were laughing too hard and Byron posted something like "Please stay on topic.".


He actually said "No trolling", which I found equally amusing. I'm frankly surpised he didn't just delete it.....
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Postby SandChigger » Thu Jan 24, 2008 4:43 pm

Oops. :oops:

Memory ain't what it used to be. Oh well. ;)

(Chani: great question! :D )
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Postby chanilover » Fri Jan 25, 2008 5:57 am

Oh no, it wasn't my question, I can't remember who asked it. I think I asked what substance was the desert planet Arrakis coverd with which rhymes with 'bland'.
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