Just try to read the whole thing without busting out laughing.Fans of Frank Herbert's "Dune" series will find all of the author's motifs and touchstones intact in "The Winds of Dune." Brian Herbert (Frank Herbert's son) and Kevin J. Anderson have retained the essence of the classic science fiction novel.....
Clueless reviewer
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Clueless reviewer
Some guy named Rege Behe appears to be a fawning, mindless fan of Brian & KJA, and shows it in this review. Check out the capsule review over at the left side:
"I'm being ironic. Don't interrupt a man in the midst of being ironic, it's not polite." -- Bradbury, The Martian Chronicles
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Re: Clueless reviewer
Thanks, but I already figured that out.In "Winds of Dune," which falls chronologically after "Dune Messiah," his behavior at the end of Frank Herbert's last book — abandoning his just-born children and disappearing into the desert of Arrakis — is explained.
They were destroyed because they lied pretentiously. Have no fear that my wrath
will fall upon you because of your innocent mistakes.
~Leto II, God Emperor
will fall upon you because of your innocent mistakes.
~Leto II, God Emperor
Re: Clueless reviewer
It seems to me that many people nowadays need to distinguish the difference in reading a book and just looking at the words.
"On the Eight day, God created Wizards because he knew he'd have to retconn some crazy shit."
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Re: Clueless reviewer
I think that if their lips are moving while looking at the book, that means they're actually reading.Ampoliros wrote:It seems to me that many people nowadays need to distinguish the difference in reading a book and just looking at the words.
They were destroyed because they lied pretentiously. Have no fear that my wrath
will fall upon you because of your innocent mistakes.
~Leto II, God Emperor
will fall upon you because of your innocent mistakes.
~Leto II, God Emperor
Re: Clueless reviewer
what, no comment section ?
I hate it when they do that ...
Not as tired as I am of this, tho :
and here's another sterling example of proof that Keith just
simply doesn't understand Frank's Dune :
or skim over or whatever ?
"How can you sympathize with him?"
Maybe that's what it is - Paul's not Luke Skywalker,
and Keith can't deal with that ....
I hate it when they do that ...
I'm soooo tired of hearing this.The last book the elder Herbert published, "Chapterhouse Dune," ends with a cliffhanger; clearly, he planned to continue the series.
Not as tired as I am of this, tho :
yeah, after "House Atreides", everybody threw roses & went home ..."There was a lot of doubt, and it's understandable," says Brian Herbert, who noted fans became more forgiving when "Dune: House Atreides" was published in 1999. "They have a stake in the 'Dune' universe, whether they are fans or editors or publishers. We're just trying to meet those high standards."
and here's another sterling example of proof that Keith just
simply doesn't understand Frank's Dune :
what book did he read ?"In my mind and in my heart, as a fan, and for many fans, Paul Atreides is one of the greatest heroes of science fiction," Anderson says. "But Frank Herbert did some terrible things to him, and when you read how he acts in 'Dune Messiah,' a lot of the things he does are virtually inexcusable. How can you sympathize with him? ... You have to get into this character. What would change somebody so much? What would drive him to do that?"
or skim over or whatever ?
"How can you sympathize with him?"
Maybe that's what it is - Paul's not Luke Skywalker,
and Keith can't deal with that ....
and when has Keith written anything close to that ?One of the other aspects of "Dune" is its many layers. It can be read as an adventure story, as a psychological novel, or a commentary on political machinations. Brian Herbert said his father told him that he wanted to weave his ideas about ecology, politics, religion and psychology into the fabric of an adventure story. The elder Herbert also wanted readers to come away from the books with "detritus, pieces of the characters, still clinging to them," he says. "The reader, dad said, would then want to go back and read an entirely different layer in the novel."
Last edited by SandRider on Sun Aug 30, 2009 11:40 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Re: Clueless reviewer
That statement qualifies him well beyond dumbass, fucking moron doesnt make justice either. i think we need to come up with a new, strong sounding word in the english language to classify him."In my mind and in my heart, as a fan, and for many fans, Paul Atreides is one of the greatest heroes of science fiction," Anderson says. "But Frank Herbert did some terrible things to him, and when you read how he acts in 'Dune Messiah,' a lot of the things he does are virtually inexcusable. How can you sympathize with him? ... You have to get into this character. What would change somebody so much? What would drive him to do that?"
That something like this happened to a legacy like Frank's takes away a lot of the faith i have in mankind.
"But if self-replication can be considered a life-form, then intelligence should be, too.
The real problem is that "life" is such an unscientific word" - Masamune Shirow
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Re: Clueless reviewer
Half the people out there are below average intelligence.Seraphan wrote:That statement qualifies him well beyond dumbass, fucking moron doesnt make justice either. i think we need to come up with a new, strong sounding word in the english language to classify him."In my mind and in my heart, as a fan, and for many fans, Paul Atreides is one of the greatest heroes of science fiction," Anderson says. "But Frank Herbert did some terrible things to him, and when you read how he acts in 'Dune Messiah,' a lot of the things he does are virtually inexcusable. How can you sympathize with him? ... You have to get into this character. What would change somebody so much? What would drive him to do that?"
That something like this happened to a legacy like Frank's takes away a lot of the faith i have in mankind.
(Verified by KJA book sales.)
They were destroyed because they lied pretentiously. Have no fear that my wrath
will fall upon you because of your innocent mistakes.
~Leto II, God Emperor
will fall upon you because of your innocent mistakes.
~Leto II, God Emperor
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Re: Clueless reviewer
I actually find KJA's misunderstanding of humanity (and by extension both Paul and Dune) a rather popular phenomenon. Very few people actually want to understand, let alone embrace, the totality of what it is to be a human being. Most people, KJA included, would much rather hold onto the illusions of what makes a great human than accept a human can be great.
I can't even begin to count how many times I've been in discussions about some noted historical figure only for some dumbass to stride in with a character assassination based on some mundane human flaw. He/she "stole" all his/her ideas. He/she had sex. He/she was an asshole. He/she avoided conscription. He/she wasn't a gawd-fearing person. It's like most people never realized everyone has feet of clay and refuse to accept any person who elevates themselves above the masses unless that person meets this unrealistic expectation of perfection. This goes the same for villains as well. No one wants to understand Hitler. He was a monster, a villain, perhaps for many he was Satan himself. Very few people will ever acknowledge that Hitler was simply human. True, Hitler was a despicable and monstrous human, but a human nonetheless. Nothing more.
KJA is a common example of what most people want: to elevate Paul to the status of epic, flawless, ubermensch hero while ignoring his own humanity. They want to think of Paul as infallible god-hero, even more so since he has extraordinary abilities within the fictional context of Dune. Mistakes, faults, poor choices; these are all the problems associated with lesser beings, not great infallible god-heroes of great destiny like Paul Atreides.
Of course, Frank wanted to explore all sides of the messiah as a human sociopolitical phenomenon, the triumphs and the failures. But it's clear even some of Frank's readers didn't understand this, KJA least of all.
I can't even begin to count how many times I've been in discussions about some noted historical figure only for some dumbass to stride in with a character assassination based on some mundane human flaw. He/she "stole" all his/her ideas. He/she had sex. He/she was an asshole. He/she avoided conscription. He/she wasn't a gawd-fearing person. It's like most people never realized everyone has feet of clay and refuse to accept any person who elevates themselves above the masses unless that person meets this unrealistic expectation of perfection. This goes the same for villains as well. No one wants to understand Hitler. He was a monster, a villain, perhaps for many he was Satan himself. Very few people will ever acknowledge that Hitler was simply human. True, Hitler was a despicable and monstrous human, but a human nonetheless. Nothing more.
KJA is a common example of what most people want: to elevate Paul to the status of epic, flawless, ubermensch hero while ignoring his own humanity. They want to think of Paul as infallible god-hero, even more so since he has extraordinary abilities within the fictional context of Dune. Mistakes, faults, poor choices; these are all the problems associated with lesser beings, not great infallible god-heroes of great destiny like Paul Atreides.
Of course, Frank wanted to explore all sides of the messiah as a human sociopolitical phenomenon, the triumphs and the failures. But it's clear even some of Frank's readers didn't understand this, KJA least of all.
"What are we to call him, this Player of Games?"
"The books of Kevin J Anderson and Brian Herbert lie in a realm of uncertainty between self-conscious absurdity and genuine failure"
"The books of Kevin J Anderson and Brian Herbert lie in a realm of uncertainty between self-conscious absurdity and genuine failure"
Re: Clueless reviewer
I see this as the major reason Frank had the Gom Jabbar Test to determine human vs animal. I really wish we had something like this today.GamePlayer wrote:I actually find KJA's misunderstanding of humanity (and by extension both Paul and Dune) a rather popular phenomenon. Very few people actually want to understand, let alone embrace, the totality of what it is to be a human being. Most people, KJA included, would much rather hold onto the illusions of what makes a great human than accept a human can be great.
I can't even begin to count how many times I've been in discussions about some noted historical figure only for some dumbass to stride in with a character assassination based on some mundane human flaw. He/she "stole" all his/her ideas. He/she had sex. He/she was an asshole. He/she avoided conscription. He/she wasn't a gawd-fearing person. It's like most people never realized everyone has feet of clay and refuse to accept any person who elevates themselves above the masses unless that person meets this unrealistic expectation of perfection. This goes the same for villains as well. No one wants to understand Hitler. He was a monster, a villain, perhaps for many he was Satan himself. Very few people will ever acknowledge that Hitler was simply human. True, Hitler was a despicable and monstrous human, but a human nonetheless. Nothing more.
KJA is a common example of what most people want: to elevate Paul to the status of epic, flawless, ubermensch hero while ignoring his own humanity. They want to think of Paul as infallible god-hero, even more so since he has extraordinary abilities within the fictional context of Dune. Mistakes, faults, poor choices; these are all the problems associated with lesser beings, not great infallible god-heroes of great destiny like Paul Atreides.
Of course, Frank wanted to explore all sides of the messiah as a human sociopolitical phenomenon, the triumphs and the failures. But it's clear even some of Frank's readers didn't understand this, KJA least of all.
"On the Eight day, God created Wizards because he knew he'd have to retconn some crazy shit."
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Re: Clueless reviewer
FH wrote about this in GEoD. Combat for men and birthing for women is as close as the average person gets.Ampoliros wrote:I see this as the major reason Frank had the Gom Jabbar Test to determine human vs animal. I really wish we had something like this today.GamePlayer wrote:I actually find KJA's misunderstanding of humanity (and by extension both Paul and Dune) a rather popular phenomenon. Very few people actually want to understand, let alone embrace, the totality of what it is to be a human being. Most people, KJA included, would much rather hold onto the illusions of what makes a great human than accept a human can be great.
I can't even begin to count how many times I've been in discussions about some noted historical figure only for some dumbass to stride in with a character assassination based on some mundane human flaw. He/she "stole" all his/her ideas. He/she had sex. He/she was an asshole. He/she avoided conscription. He/she wasn't a gawd-fearing person. It's like most people never realized everyone has feet of clay and refuse to accept any person who elevates themselves above the masses unless that person meets this unrealistic expectation of perfection. This goes the same for villains as well. No one wants to understand Hitler. He was a monster, a villain, perhaps for many he was Satan himself. Very few people will ever acknowledge that Hitler was simply human. True, Hitler was a despicable and monstrous human, but a human nonetheless. Nothing more.
KJA is a common example of what most people want: to elevate Paul to the status of epic, flawless, ubermensch hero while ignoring his own humanity. They want to think of Paul as infallible god-hero, even more so since he has extraordinary abilities within the fictional context of Dune. Mistakes, faults, poor choices; these are all the problems associated with lesser beings, not great infallible god-heroes of great destiny like Paul Atreides.
Of course, Frank wanted to explore all sides of the messiah as a human sociopolitical phenomenon, the triumphs and the failures. But it's clear even some of Frank's readers didn't understand this, KJA least of all.
They were destroyed because they lied pretentiously. Have no fear that my wrath
will fall upon you because of your innocent mistakes.
~Leto II, God Emperor
will fall upon you because of your innocent mistakes.
~Leto II, God Emperor