BSG Season 4 (spoilers)

[Omphalos]

That was a pretty good episode last night. I always had the hots for Dualla. Gonna miss seeing her. It looked to me like Felix wants to kill Lee. What do you think about that?

So we now have a new dilemma. Tigh's wife seems to be the last cylon. Not only did she seem to understand the rebirth process, but she was on Earth during the nuclear war. Since all the "humans" there were cylons, it would seem that she is the final model. I'm wondering if Starbuck is some new model; a new kind of hybrid. This would make her a cylon too, but not one of the original twelve. I guess they will need to come up with a new zodiac sign and colony besides Earth for a thirteenth model of cylon now. If she is, where are they producing her?

I really hope they don't leave as many holes as I am foreseeing that they will leave. There are just too many unanswered questions for me now. I don't see how they will ever wrap up all the loose ends.

[Mandy]

It was a really good episode. I wonder if they'll have the time to tie up the loose ends too.

I post this link at Worm's and Jacurutu, it's an interview with RDM along with comments on the episode from several writers. It's an interesting read.
http://featuresblogs.chicagotribune.com ... -dee-.html

[SandRider]

I just watched the thing on the DVR.

I'm confused as all hell.
(but, Omph, wasn't it you over at jacurutu that said it would be ellen ?)

Okay, so two thousand years ago, humans of the 13th tribe went
to earth, built their own cylons, who rebelled or took over or something,
and killed all the humans and destroyed all the human bodies and
then were themselves destroyed ?

or the 13th tribe was cylons ?

ok, whatever, the "final five" escaped from earth 2K years ago and
made it back to the other 12 colonies, where those humans were
building cylons ? or the "final five" are the creators of the 12 colonies'
cylons, and that's why the other cylons have the final five in their
mythology ?

the article Mandy posted is more evidence that these guys just made
shit up as they went along. which is fine, for what it is. decent time-
killing TV. but the plot holes and shoddy thinking will mar the series
as "classic". Kinda like all the stupid star wars prequel nonsense
devalued that story. Kind like .... Dune.

I thought about looking at the BSG message board to try to figure it
out, but those folks are really annoying.

So is BSG our future or past ?

I still think the basic problem with the plotting of the show was the
changing of the cylons to be man-made machines that rebelled.
In the original show, the actual cylons were purple aliens and the
chrome centurions were just their robot soliders.

but they went the DUNE-route with no known alien species, and that
does make it an entirely HUMAN story, which is always more interesting.

whatever. I watched and will watch. I'll get the last season's DVDs and
this one, too. Good eye-candy. Just don't think too hard about it.

[Mandy]

I'm just guessing, but I think BSG is in our future. That is only based on the NYC skyline. Also, I think they were saying that the 13th tribe was cylon. I wonder if they were the Lords of Kobol.. shit I can't remember all the prophesy stuff anymore.

I agree about the BSG message boards, those people are nuts.

[Omphalos]

I don't think that there is any time traveling going on here, though I do admit that they are setting it up so that could work. I think that something happened in the colonies 2000 years ago, and on Earth too. Earth just did not survive it.

As far as the other questions about the series are concerned, they are in the middle of a sharp left hand turn from what I was thinking. I cant wait to find out more. This show is going to live with me for a loooooong time.

And yes, SR. I have been joking about the Galactica herself being a cylon, but Ellen was my main candidate. Her and Starbuck; though they also set that up so that it could have been any one of them.

These recent revelations are also kind of screwing up the way that I thought they would go with the spin-off series that is going to start next year. I wonder what they are going to do with that one now?

[SandChigger]

Yeah, if the Cylons have been around for thousands of years, it doesn't make sense that the braniac Harkon...er, non-Adama-family person invents their Eve-Mother Cylon, does it?

Feh.

But, heh heh, I've suspected Ellen from the start. Tigh's one, too, you say?

[Nekhrun]

Maybe Starbuck is Ellen and Tigh's daughter. Apparently Saul has the ability to impregnate Cylons. Or maybe his kid with 6 will come out with Starbuck's DNA too.



Edit: I just started a new thread without spoilers where we can talk about things that have already aired without spoilers.

I would like to find a place to discuss things/theories, but not find out any spoilers from inside info. people may pick up from other places. I'll try to set one up now.

[SandRider]

damn, Omph, for just a minute there, while I was reading your post, it
all made sense and fit together. Then I lost it. (it's 1pm Sunday here on
the Edge of the Staked Plains of Texas, and I just got up - fucking insane
night at the deadhorse last night. Three Florida Warlocks rolled thru on
their way to Arizona - fucking tore the place fucking UP. Spent midnight
to 3am on the sidewalk out front with the entire Townie Keystones and the
County boys, sorting it all out. It was like a fucking movie, one of my lawyers
actually showed up in his trenchcoat and pajamas.)

WTF? Oh yeah.

"This has all happened before." There's your theme-key.
How old were the colonies ? 2K ? Everybody living on Kobol with
the "gods", then split ? "Gods" and "cylons" and "humans" and the
"one God", all rolling around creating and destroying each other in
cycles ? Something convoluted like that.

Unfortunately, for me, I'm getting less enjoyment out of the whole thing,
going back to the introduction of the "final five" as who they turned out
to be. (Esp. Anders) It's the whole "writing on the fly" during the production
of the show, like Lost. As you know, I'm a big Tolkien & Herbert fan. Both
those men spent years (in Tolkien's case, decades) working out their stories.

It's really marred the show for me. I love the look of the show. I love the
simulated "hand-held" shaky camera shots in space, panning over the fleet
and zooming in on a little craft streaking by, barely able to keep it in frame.

I've loved the characteraztion and the acting, the drama. I love the sudden
jolting little plot twists - like when Helo shot Sharon, to send her back to
the base ship to get the baby. (Helo's been a fantastic character). I've also
loved the big plot twists and mythos and mystery - but I'm afraid the reveal
of the overall story is going to be weak. It already is weak, and unbelievable.

I think in the future, this series will been called a lot of "Almosts".

Maybe between this & the debacle that is Lost, TV writers will learn something.
Long, complicated mystery-based shows can work and be good art &
popular - but you gotta do more thinking BEFORE you start shooting.

[SandRider]

along the same lines, and I've thought this forever,
how hard would it be to run some of those ideas past
a skeptical audience, people like me and some of y'all,
before they do something lame ?

I get the feeling the writers sit around a table, like
the Bush Administration, and toss out ideas. No-one
objective is there to say, "Hey, that's as stupid as all get-out."


{edit}

against my better judgement, which I do sometimes have,
I just went to have a look-see @ the "official" BSG forum.
And I'd thought this before, but:

my G-d, are those people stupid.

I mean, STOOPID, dumb, no discernable cognitive ability,
dumber than the box the rocks came in.

they make the pretards Over There look like MENSA.

[SandChigger]

It'd be like The Hack and his "test readers" (read: trained monkeys). Unless you use a new, randomly chosen group each time, you eventually end up with a bunch of "yes-people" who tell you what they think you want to hear just to maintain their "privileged" position.

(I've never checked out the official forum. Where is it?)

[SandRider]

http://battlestargalacticaforum.com/mbb ... asp?fid=31


that will take you straight to the stupid shit,
which is what I know you want .....

[SandChigger]

You know me too well ... and too soon!

I'll have a look through the threads later. Just the titles...

"Richard Hatch asks YOU how will it end?"

Richard Hatch ... the only "actor" who gets a bigger "ugh" response from me is Dirk "The Dick" Benedict. ("Whaaan! Whaaan! They've emasculated Starbuck! Boo hoo!" )

[Mandy]

That's a fansite, this is the official forum.
http://forums.scifi.com/index.php?s=37f ... owforum=24

[SandRider]

yeah, you're right, that the's SciFi Channel's board -
they're simple-minded idiots, too.

[Mandy]

TV shows bring out the internet fruitcakes. I think there are people out there who think the characters are real people.

[SandChigger]

You mean ... they're not?

[Mandy]

lol..

I used to post at Ragnar Anchorage, but the rabid Grace Park fans drove me nuts. They even ran Aaron Douglas (Tyrol) off the board, when he came by for a chat.

[SandChigger]

Sounds like a story there....???

(How did they do it?)

[Mandy]

They were pissed at him for breaking up with Boomer, lol.

[Omphalos]

They were pissed at him for breaking up with Boomer, lol.

Sounds like a fun thing to do when you should be working. Assault some blameless Canadian.

[SandChigger]

There's NO SUCH THING!


(By the way, darlin', love the new sigs, but that should be "ad Hypatiam". )


________________________
"[Hyppo] was stripped naked and dragged through the streets to the newly christianised Caesareum church and killed. Some reports suggest she was flayed with ostrakois (literally, "oyster shells", though also used to refer to roof tiles or broken pottery) and set ablaze while still alive, though other accounts suggest those actions happened after her death...."

[Mandy]

Well, they added the um after Hitler, so I just went with that, lol. I'll change it.

[Omphalos]

Hitler is a masculine word because he was a man. Hyppo, well, I suppose we should be using the neuter, but since it holds itself out as a woman, Chig has suggested the feminine.

Or is there even a difference in the....accusative? Im so rusty.

[Mandy]

I ain't gonna check under her skirt to find out.

[Omphalos]

I ain't gonna check under her skirt to find out.

Ew. Don't let anything nasty drip on you.

[The Phantom]

I ain't gonna check under her skirt to find out.

Ew. Don't let anything nasty drip on you.

:vomit:
ugh where's that vomit smiley

[SandChigger]

I believe the nominative and the accusative are the same for neuter nouns in Latin.

(Actually, that's true for a lot of Indo-European languages. )

[Omphalos]

I believe the nominative and the accusative are the same for neuter nouns in Latin.

(Actually, that's true for a lot of Indo-European languages. )

For the singular, and for declensions other than one and two, which along with three are what the majority of nouns fall into. but with like the 4th, where the endings in the singular are -u, -us, -u, -u, -u, IRIC, that sure is the case.

Like I said, its been years. Though I did take Latin classes from 7th grade through my senior year in college.

If Hyppo is feminine, then the acc sing is -am. If its neuter, then I think its -um. So...is Hyppo classifiable? Personally, I dont see too many feminine characteristics there. Maybe we should go with the job title. If you consider that she shovels a lot of shit, than she is an agricola, which is feminine, 1st decl. Yea, that makes sense.

[Mandy]

Anyway, it looks better with am. Too many vowels in the other.

[SandChigger]

Declino (nomina latina), ergo sum.

[Star Dust]

Et tu, Chiggerum?

[SandChigger]

Veni, veni, veni.


Whoa...that sounds like a porno flick.

[Omphalos]

Veni, veni, veni.


Whoa...that sounds like a porno flick.

I saw some movie a long time ago that was all in classical latin. Wish I could remember the title. One character kept calling another "Oedipe! Oedipe!" Took me a while but I eventually came to the conclusion that he was calling him a mother-fucker.

[SandRider]

Mel Gibson's Jesus movie ?

[Omphalos]

Mel Gibson's Jesus movie ?

No, I think that was mostly in Aramaic, with some Latin. This one was totally in Latin. I think it was the only one that has ever been done completely in Latin, which would make it easy to find if I werent so lazy.

[SandChigger]

In Google we trust:

Jarman made his debut in "overground" narrative filmmaking with the groundbreaking Sebastiane (1976), arguably the first British film to feature positive images of gay sexuality, and the first (and to date, only) film entirely in Latin.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sebastiane

[Omphalos]

In Google we trust:

Jarman made his debut in "overground" narrative filmmaking with the groundbreaking Sebastiane (1976), arguably the first British film to feature positive images of gay sexuality, and the first (and to date, only) film entirely in Latin.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sebastiane

Well. I certainly dont remember any boners or much gay contact. I must have seen a cut version of it. Im pretty sure that is the film, but I sure dont remember that cover.

I mean...uh...I was just hanging out with the guys, honey! C'mon...you know????

That one guy looks like he is enjoying being shot by the arrow, huh?

[Liege-Killer]

Though I did take Latin classes from 7th grade through my senior year in college.

Damn, that's a lotta Latin! What's that, ten years' worth?

I wish I could have had some in high school, but I went to a tiny school and my choices were Spanish, and Spanish. So Latin had to wait for college.

Declino (nomina latina), ergo sum.

Yeah, ain't that the truth?

[Omphalos]

Though I did take Latin classes from 7th grade through my senior year in college.

Damn, that's a lotta Latin! What's that, ten years' worth?

I wish I could have had some in high school, but I went to a tiny school and my choices were Spanish, and Spanish. So Latin had to wait for college.

Declino (nomina latina), ergo sum.

Yeah, ain't that the truth?

Shiiiit, man! That was ten years of Latin in college alone!

[SandRider]

well, that was all bullshit on a about a hundred different levels.

meh.


BTW, Admiral Adama is the "Dying Frakking Leader."


feh.

[Mandy]

Yeah, I bet he is, too. Anyway, the episode was boring and a waste of time. They only had 10 episodes to tell the end of the story and they wasted one on Roslin jogging around the ship. If that's an example of RM's directing skills, I hope he doesn't direct anymore.

[SandRider]

I readily admit to being a cranky, ill-tempered, mean-spirited,
crusty old curmudgeon, who gets a vicarious thrill out of bad
mouthing people, places, and things, with or without cause.

but.

I really have enjoyed this show, on occasion. I really thought,
especially in the first season, and maybe around the "Razor"
period, that it had the potential to be one of the all-time great
TV shows.

I'm saddened and confused, and slightly angered, that they
could let it go to this complete out of control nonsense.

And all of a sudden, Gaius hates God ? WTF ?

[Mandy]

Baltar was pissed, and drunk. I think his hopes were crushed when they discovered that earth was destroyed.

From an article in the Chicago Tribune:

Baltar’s scene is getting very dark. Is that meant to evoke a Jim Jones/People’s Temple sort of thing, like, “Something bad is going to happen here?”

It’s certainly coming right up to the edge of that, yeah. It felt right that, again, with Earth turning out to be nothing, Baltar has invested in this idea of God, that God will protect His children and take them somewhere. “We all have to give ourselves over to God.” And then God takes you *here*. And Baltar’s response is, “Well, [expletive] God! Maybe he should come down here and apologize to us!”

I thought he was maybe advocating some position like, “We have been unworthy children. What sins have you committed, what have you done wrong?” That kind of thing. Is there that element of it too, perhaps we brought God’s wrath down on us?

There’s a bit of that, but mostly he was saying that, “Is this your fault, what dark thoughts have you had, what evil thoughts have you had? Nothing? Then maybe it’s not your fault.”

So... atheism! It’s Baltar’s new thing!

“Atheism! [laughter] Let’s go back to that!” Because this God thing isn’t working out so well either.

Oh and RM had this to say about Adama's pill popping:

Adama keeps saying he doesn’t feel well in the episode. Is that, again, just the “disquiet”? What’s that about? Is it just that he’s very tired?

Yeah, it’s just that, there are just so many things weighing on him. He’s been drinking a lot. He’s been taking pain pills. He’s just not feeling good.

I can see that. I just didn’t know if there was anything more to it than that. I don’t know if I can take anyone else checking out.

It’s not a sign of something deeper.

You can read the whole thing HERE

Of course RM has lied before about Starbuck, so he could be lying now.

[Liege-Killer]

I really don't understand this concept of giving out information in interviews. If I were producing a show like this, I'd keep my mouth shut, I wouldn't tell anyone a damn thing, except "keep watching to find out."

[SandRider]

off the top of my head, two things -

one, Moore is a KJA-style media whore.

but two, Moore has made some KJA-style plot
mistakes, and is trying to keep his audience.

I'd imagine the producers and staff of the show are
well aware of the all the internet speculation - as
opposed to the HLP that doesn't have that kind of
resources or give-a-damn.

I think the writer's strike that postponed this last
set of episodes was an unlucky break, too. Gave
the kids a few too many months to speculate and
raise expectations.

But after last week, the baby turning out not to be a
Cylon hybrid after all, well, I don't feel like thinking very
hard about any of it. What's the point ? Finding Earth and
finding it destroyed was Okay, that's sorta consistent with the
build-up-hope-and-destroy-it themes they've been doing. But
if they're just gonna randomly veer off major plot points, there's
no "facts" for speculative theories; which has been some of the
fun of the show.

I'm with Tom Zarek. Frak the Cylons and Frak Tigh and Frak Adama.
Helo is still the only character that hasn't completely pissed me off. (yet)

[SandChigger]

But if they're just gonna randomly veer off major plot points, there's no "facts" for speculative theories; which has been some of the fun of the show.

That's exactly the KJA Dune problem.

[Mandy]

ugh.. I hate Helo Ever since he sabotaged the plan to kill the Cylons with that virus I haven't had any use for him.

There are only a few more episodes left, so I don't think Moore is worried about hanging onto the audience. Those of us who have watched everything up til now, will most likely stick it out to the end. I agree that he is a media whore.. he's always loved to talk about whatever he is working on. He also posts online at different sites when he has the time, so I know he is aware of what the fans think. At least he's not afraid to interact with them! His wife used to post on the scifi.com board, but the psychos finally got to her and she left.

The baby thing was a retcon. Kinda pisses me off, because you could tell they just threw that in there to keep the story of Hera being special straight.

[SandRider]

how can you hate Helo ? he's the only decent, moral, caring person there is.

he's the only one who seems to think about the consequences of actions, to
actually weigh out considerations, the only one with genuine emotions ....

oh, shit.

he's a cylon, too, isn't he ?

[Mandy]

I'm beginning to think they're all cylons.

[SandChigger]

Actually, um, I'm a Cylon.

[Omphalos]

Actually, um, I'm a Cylon.

Well then why haven't I ever seen you at any of the meetings?

[SandRider]

he's not that kind of cylon ...

[Omphalos]

he's not that kind of cylon ...

I'm not talking about the Cylon meetings in public 'loos in Hyde Park.

[SandChigger]

In the 'loos? Ugh, how barbaric.

We meet on Jeckyll Green or nowhere at all!

[Sparafucile]

so last friday's episode was pretty good. I only really started watching this last season (last half and this half) but I'm kind of impressed. Shit just went down. Can't wait for friday!

[Star Dust]

Good riddance Tom Zarek. Shooting him was less than he deserved.

Not super crazy about the feel-good ending to this one, what with all the
peeps sweeping in behind Adama on his march to the CIC. Those marines
were suddenly on his side again? What about Kara telling him "Those aren't
your people anymore!"? The coup momentum shift wasn't adequately segued, in
my opinion. Still, another strong ep. I think that Gaeta, in the end, was a
good character for the show, like him or not. But he had to die.

[Omphalos]

Im thinking that the fallout is not over yet.

[SandRider]

I thought the execution of the council by Zarek was a cheap, forced
move - the coup had to end in this episode, Zarek and Gaeta [i]were[i]
going to die, one way or another. Zarek just going ape-shit on the spur
of the moment was a quick (cheap) fix.

I thought it was really out of character. Zarek could surely be a ruthless
man, but that was fucking pointless. The only explanation I'll buy is that
when he finally, finally got his hands on the real power, he flipped out.

But for that to really work, there needed to be atleast one other scene of him
going crazy. maybe it's in the deleted scenes pile we'll get in a year or
so....

[Mandy]

They had to cut most of the scenes with Zarek and the Quorum. I'm glad he's dead, anyway, they should have killed him a long time ago.

http://featuresblogs.chicagotribune.com ... ngeli.html

I'm a little unclear on what the Quorum knew and when they knew it. Had they heard Laura's broadcast from Baltar's headquarters? Did they know that Gaeta and Zarek had seized control -- or were attempting to seize control -- of the fleet? Did they know that Adama and Tigh and others were in the custody of the rebels? Did they assemble to hear out Zarek because they thought the coup was non-violent?

Yes, The Quorum was able to hear enough of Laura’s partial transmission as she was escaping and they also heard some of Gaeta’s orders. Originally, there was a brief scene on Colonial One where Zarek and the Quorom are monitoring the transmissions but there was so much to cover in the episode that it just had to go.

Zarek brought the Quorum with him to Galactica where they would be “safe” and he could keep an eye on them, keep them close. He gives them one last chance to support his presidency by making this “from-the-heart” plea to them; he thinks he can flatter them with praise and, as we know, it doesn’t quite work,does it?

Even if the Quorum had gone along with Zarek, would he have killed them anyway?

Don’t know. We could ask him, but he’s dead.

Why did the Quorum resist Zarek's coup, given that their relations with Laura Roslin and William Adama had not been very smooth?

The Zarek/Quorum scene had to be edited for time. What got cut was Zarek informing the Quorom that President Roslin has defected, he’s assumed the presidency and appointed Gaeta to replace Admiral Adama, who is to be tried for treason. The quorum vocally objects to Zarek making all of these decisions without including them. But even with this material excised, I think the scene works well. It’s a little more of a shock when they rebuff Zarek, gives them some cojones before they’re wiped out.

[SandRider]

I got it. It'll all make sense when they release the boxed set
($259.99 at Best Buy - "Do you have a Reward Zones Card, sir ?" -
"Do want me to hit you in your mouth, son ? " - "Well, no sir." -
"Shut up and give me my stuff.")

[Mandy]

The Canadian promo for next week is a little different from the one they showed in the US. It's only 30 seconds long, won't take long to download.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wbC4KkAUiL8

[SandRider]

Kinda tired of that "All will be revealed" stuff.

And goodl-rd, I hope Anders finally remembers something.
Dude's dumber'n the box the rocks came it.

That 8 zinged his ass last week tho -
"I don't know anything !"
"You might not want to let them know that."
and then the bumfuzzled look on his face.
priceless.

That's not much different from the one I saw - Ellen in the hottub.
Extra stuff from Anders. And wow, youtube commenters are brainchildren, eh ?

anyway, thank you darlin, even tho that 30 seconds took 7 minutes to download.
{and seriously, what's your yahooID ? If you need a webcam you can move
around, let me know ...}

[Omphalos]

About the Kara Thrace being on Earth thing: My brother and I were talking about that this evening. I wondered aloud if she could be Number 7, and Ragabash wondered if she could just be a younger version of Tigh's wife. That would give a new spin on all of Tigh's attention to her.

[SandRider]

final five age, eh ? proof is Saul's hair.

I'm done speculating. These bastards have shown over and over again
they're going to set something up and then take it another direction ...

suspending brain function for the last 7 episodes ....

[Mandy]

I don't have a YahooID

If Kara is a younger version of Ellen, it would explain a lot.. especially since she died on earth and came back to life. BUT.. if Anders gets his memory back when Ellen wakes up in the tub o' goo, then she should have some memories returning too.

[Star Dust]

Regarding Kara. When she originally crashed and died, didn't her Viper blow up when she got too close to a gas giant? If so, how did the wreckage get to Earth?

[Omphalos]

I don't have a YahooID

If Kara is a younger version of Ellen, it would explain a lot.. especially since she died on earth and came back to life. BUT.. if Anders gets his memory back when Ellen wakes up in the tub o' goo, then she should have some memories returning too.

Ill bet Anders gets his memory back from the head wound, or something like that.

[Mandy]

I bet Kara gives him a sympathy frak

[Star Dust]

BSG death pool.

Next character of note to die? Saul Tigh.

[SandRider]

You mean this Friday ?
Who's going to die this Friday ?

Boomer & Racetrack.

[Mandy]

Yeah, I think Racetrack is toast. Don't know about Boomer, she's with Cavil. I haven't read anything about the next episode so I don't know when the rest of the Cylons will show up.

[Omphalos]

Prediction: Everyone on the ship is a descendant of Cylons from Earth. Earth was the source planet, not a destination for some fabled 13th Colony. When the humans die, they got to a resurrection facility, which in the culture has become known as "Heaven," where souls are reborn.

[SandRider]

Chigger : Felix wasn't airlocked - he & Tom Zarek were executed by firing squad for the coup. Then airlocked.

[Ampoliros]

So when Gaeta downloads, do he and Ellen frak?

If Anders remembers everything then he'll know if Starbuck is the Tigh's kid. I don't think she is. I still think that Ellen is a Six and Gaeta is Seven. (Felix, Lucky Seven)

Didn't they say that one of the Cylons had been boxed waaay back in Season 2? Who was it? I know they haven't said officially.

[SandChigger]

executed by firing squad for the coup. Then airlocked.

Thanks for the info. But talk about overkill.

[Ampoliros]

Not really, Zarek needed to be dealt with, and Geata had gone off the deep end. If he had about 20 more seconds in command I think he would have shot Zarek himself though.

[Omphalos]

executed by firing squad for the coup. Then airlocked.

Thanks for the info. But talk about overkill.

I dont think that they showed them getting airlocked. And we only heard them getting shot. Ill bet the corpses are still on board in the meat locker where the original Sharon's corpse is.

[Star Dust]

executed by firing squad for the coup. Then airlocked.

Thanks for the info. But talk about overkill.

I dont think that they showed them getting airlocked. And we only heard them getting shot. Ill bet the corpses are still on board in the meat locker where the original Sharon's corpse is.

Their all gonna be in the meat locker if they don't start putting some putty
on those cracks in the hull.

[SandRider]

so Omph was half-right - Galactica will become a cylon ....

[Omphalos]

I should get a job writing this stuff.

[Star Dust]

I still got confused on some of the timeline stuff. Maybe I'm confused on
more than just that.

1) Basically, Ellen is the 13th Cylon
2) The #7 Cylon is named Daniel and his/her line may or may not be
dead. At the very least Cavil/John fucked his/her DNA up. He/she was a
sensitive artist type.
3) The Final 5 arrived at the 12 Colonies sometime shortly before or
during the first Cylon wars.
4) The Final 5 helped the [colonial] centurions design and build the other 8.
5) The [colonial] centurions were already attempting their own version of
a bio-Cylon.
6) The F5 were tricked by Cavil, boxed, memories wiped, fake memories
implanted, then reinserted into the 12 Colonies population. Tigh was the
first implemented.

What I'm still (knowingly) fuzzy about are the F5's whereabouts and
actions during the whole Kobol/Earth era. I missed some of that when
Blanders was blathering.

[Ampoliros]

Kobol gets frakked, Human go to the colonies and Cylons go to earth (13th tribe)
13th Tribe blows itself up, F5 head to the colonies at sub-light
F5 help Colonial Cylons make the 8 Skinjobs
John Cavil/Lore screws over the F5 ( I loved Dean Stockwell in this episode, he really pulled off "Best Villian Regrets that make me evil" speech.
John Cavil Kills Daniel/(Felix Gaeta = Lucky Number 7)*

Skinjobs Nuke the Colonies

RTF Heads to Earth


Last night's episode also wins "Best Cameo Ever" with John Hodgman as the "Brain Guy"

*technically this is Supposition at this stage

[Mandy]

I can't stand Dean Stockwell in BSG. He doesn't fit the part.

Overall, I thought this episode of BSG was crappy. Too many loose ends tied up too quickly.. and some of the answers were just silly. Ellen as the Mother Goddess/technical genius made me

[Ampoliros]

I don't think those loose ends got tied up, i think we got a quick glimpse of whats going on.

I agree about Ellen, however after watching the episode again this morning ( :heart: DVR) I realized you have to think of the downloaded Ellen as a completely different person. John Cavil probably programmed her to be an alcoholic whore on purpose, as part of his revenge. only 4 episodes left!?!?!?

Still need to know what the Six means to Hera. It was a bit unrealistic when the Six picked her up during the Mutiny and Athena didn't seem to even notice.

[Mandy]

I think Athena trusts that Six now, especially since she's pregnant.

[Omphalos]

That was a bit of an info dump. No other episode was written that way. I hope the rest are about exploring the situation, not explaining it like last night's was.

[SandRider]

ok.

first off, which fucking Six is it that's pregnant ? I thought the broad in the
brig was Baltar's "Caprica Six", but I've not been able to bring myself to
watch the DVDs just to try to figure that out.

#2: bother anybody that they brought in a human brain surgeon to go poking
around in a "unknown" Cylon model ?

#3: I'll roll with it, because it's just a fucking TV show, but BULLSHIT that Cavill
is the orchestrator of all this stuff. Retcon, let's try to tie up all this bullshit we been
spinning off the top of our heads for two years, since the "Final Five" idea was smoked up.

#4: I've watched dumb-ass Anders tell his story three times on DVR, and I still don't get
all of what he was babbling about.

#5: I don't care who/what Kara Thrace is .....

[Mandy]

I think she is Caprica Six.. I don't care enough to find out for sure either. The episode was pretty bad for BSG.

This is the most hilarious recap http://www.televisionwithoutpity.com/sh ... exit_2.php

[SandRider]

that's a great recap.

[Omphalos]

Never fuck with Pinocchio!

[SandChigger]

But I thought that's why his nose grew....


(Remember: Tengu loves you! )

[Ampoliros]

ugh i see what you mean about the "official boards" They are literally posting line by line what happens. the episode thread was 10 pages long before the episode started...

stuff like "Cavils name is John" No shit?

[SandRider]

they don't even wait for commercial breaks, either, I guess they got
their laptops right there on their peckers, typing away ....

[Ampoliros]

update

No Daniel is not Starbucks father! If he was, Hera would not be important (unless Starbuck's mom is also a cylon making her the first new cylon-cylon cross).
Just because Starbuck's dad knows the song doesn't mean that he's a Cylon. I'm sick of reading threads (elsewhere) that say Anders wrote the song. no, Anders played the song for the FF. Never says he wrote it (iirc). I think the song is older than most people think. I'm thinking Kobol wasn't the first time humans and Cylons had to settle somewhere and the song and some other mythology has been passed down. I think present day earth is far in the future of the current show.

I'm thinking Starbuck is some kind of "pure" decendant from Kobol.

Anyway, Daniel can't be Starbuck's dad, because Gaeta is Daniel.

[Omphalos]

if Starbuck is not Cylon, then there may be some technology on Earth that will resurrect humans. That vortex she went into led her to crash on Earth in the past; it was some sort of time tunnel. She went back 2,000 years into the past, just after the civil war on Earth, crashed right before the final five left Earth on the slowboat to the territory of the colonies, the final five resurrected her and sent her back. That would explain the homing device on her remade viper, the corpse in the field, and possibly fulfill the prophecy that the one who leads them to Earth will die, giving Moore a chance to save Roslyn and Adama.

[Dune Nerd]

Just finished up season 4 last night, have to figure out a way to watch season five online so that I can be totally caught up. Working this late shift messes up my whole schedule.

Anyway, really enjoyed the season but hated that Razor movie thing. I thought it was fluff. Other than that liked it but don't think I can add much to the discussion here.

[Ampoliros]

her crashed viper wasn't 2000 years old. RDM has stated there won't be any time travel in BSG cause he hates time travel.

I think the 'head' people are representative of whatever the 'lords' are. I don't think they are aliens though. perhaps some kind of kobol-hybrids.

Whoever said that downloading tech doesn't work on humans? it came from Kobol remember...It might be a nice nod to Dune if the 'lords' of Kobol were some kind of whacked out Tleilaxu-ghola 'immortals' who used high-tech and religion to try and keep the 13 tribes in check. one of them thought this was a bad idea and tried to break away, and Kobol became a waste-land. (Glenn Beck is a Lord of Kobol?)

the song is representative of the cycle of 'all this has happened before/will happen again'. thats why i don't think it's original to the FF. I think as Cylons who rediscovered their past from kobol and resurrection technology they found the song when they went digging. perhaps the head-people planted it. Anders said the head-people were talking to them too, 2000 years ago.

[Ampoliros]

Anyway, really enjoyed the season but hated that Razor movie thing. I thought it was fluff. Other than that liked it but don't think I can add much to the discussion here.

I hated the Shaw character but I loved seeing the old toasters. The hybrid was frikkin awesome.

the hybrid states that his children think he is God, i think maybe they were trying to capture the essence of god, the head-people probably told the centurions that they needed to be one with humanity and they interpreted badly. ahh divine inspiration...

[Star Dust]

I liked Razor a lot, don't see what there is to complain about.

One thing about the piano playing dude...seemed to me that he just
"vanished" and it was actually just Starbuck at the piano by herself. Could
she have been subconsciously projecting? Regardless, I'm thinking
Starbuck is truly some sort of advanced hybrid being (notice that's a lower
case "h").

[SandRider]

well, it's over.

anybody care ?

funny, I don't feel like I know "The Truth" .....


Starbuck was an angel ?

What about the Seven ?

I could've done without Ron Moore's Hitchcock thing at the end,
but atleast that little scene is separate from the actual ending,
like a coda ...

Still, the battle scenes in the first hour were really good -
I kept thinking, this is what I've wanted to see thruout the
whole series, but if every episode had been flash-bang
Centurion battles instead of the dark drama, I wouldn't have
been as caught up with the characters .....

I think the overall TV lesson learned here was that if you're going to
do a several season story with big complex, mysterious plot arcs,
figure it ALL out before hand - don't try to wrap everything up in the
last few hours .....

And I was drinking, but I swear I saw some brief promo for some
show other than "Caprica" (which is really going to suck, sorry ...)
"BSG: The Plan" ?

anyway, the fact that discussion on the last few episodes dropped off
to nothing says something, anyway....

It was a great run tho, and I'm glad I was onboard.
I think this may have been the last TV show I'll ever actually watch ....

[Omphalos]

I had some big problems with it, not the least of which was an identical non-nuked copy of Earth. WTF?!?! But overall I liked it. I DVR'ed it so I can watch it again.

Oh, and that whole thing with the dead raptor pilot (Racetrace?) was totally fucking stupid.

[Liege-Killer]

I'm not gonna repeat everything I said over at Worm's. Let me just say that even though it had a lot of problems, and didn't come close to answering all the show's mysteries, still, it was a better finale than I expected, and some parts of it were actually very very good.

Omph, I don't know about that "two Earths" deal. Could be a memory malfunction on my part, but I don't remember seeing any continents on the first Earth that would serve as definitive identifiers. I vaguely recall some of the shapes being suggestive, but covered in clouds and hard to positively identify. I could be totally wrong, though.

[Omphalos]

There was only one wide-angle view of Earth, IIRC. Right before the mid-season break, in the last seconds of the last episodes, right when they discovered what was going on they panned through the path to Earth, and showed North America at the end. From then on all the continents they showed were close enough up to remove any detail, but I happen to be a whiz at geography (my second love, after SF you could say, and WAY before the law) and I was positive they were showing the Earth.

[Mandy]

I saw the promo for The Plan too.. It's going to be from the Cylon's viewpoint. By the time it airs we'll be starving for some BSG anyway, probably won't matter if it sucks

[Liege-Killer]

By the time The Plan gets here and we get the Cylons' viewpoint, I'll have forgotten the Colonials' viewpoint.

And certainly by the time Caprica rolls around I'll have forgotten a hell of a lot about this series.

Caprica looks like it might be halfway interesting, but I'd prefer a Kobol series, telling us the story of what happened there.

Omph, it sounds like your memory is better than mine on the geography. I don't remember seeing North America -- although I was thinking there was something approximating Africa? Probably another case of them changing directions and making it up as they go along. Oh well, to make sense of it I'll just chalk it up to coincidence. Lotta planets out there, some of them have to have similar-looking continents, after all.

[Ampoliros]

I'm 50/50 on the finale. they should have killed off a major character, at least one, besides roslin. My vote would have been Tigh.

a lot of people think the whole "God did it" was too much of a cop-out. the cop-out to me was the lame ending to the opera house thread. In the end, Hera was pointless, she only gave them a direction to head in, which Starbuck also had. I had figured out that the song was coordinates as soon as Hera gave the dots to Starbuck.

The heads...I wish they did more to explain them, but I'm satisfied. I think it's because you guys got me hooked on Banks' Culture. I almost see them as a couple of SC agents sent to make sure this seed-world didn't fuck up and nuke itself.

Kara...Yeah, i liked that she just disappeared, but i still want to know more, like where her raptor came from. The Culture strikes again.

The raptors launching from inside the bay, two episodes after they explain how doing that will rip the ship apart. I think they did show some damage as a result of this, but still...

I really think that a few hundred survivors would have said, have fun on earth, we're going off to find whats "out there..." They might have even gone with the Centurions.

Also, I think if it was done right, they should have tried to land Galactica on an Island in the Atlantic, probably by jumping it in 10ft off the ground or over a shallow reef. At least then they could have set up the idea of guiding humanity from the mysterious "Atlantis", and had it all get sunk when Racetrack gets hit by more dibris, randomly jumps into orbit, and launches another nuke which set off a volcanic explosion.

BTW, weren't they down to 4 nukes...why does Racetrack have 8...

Cavil. Fuck no he kills himself. That was harder to believe than "God did It all"

I guess we'll have to wait for "The Plan" to find out I've been right about Gaeta being #7.

[Rakis]

^^^^ Like he said on most of the points...

Well, endings always sucks most of the times, anyways...

I wish they would have done a 2 hour fight (like the first hour) with mostly everybody dying...and a few ones escapes, join the fleet back and goes into the sunsets... The frakkin end...

But that's me...i'm just fed up with happy, God did it all, "Let's start over without technology" endings...

[Omphalos]

The raptors launching from inside the bay, two episodes after they explain how doing that will rip the ship apart. I think they did show some damage as a result of this, but still...

Yea, it tore the gift shop to shreads. I don't think they cared at that point.

BTW, weren't they down to 4 nukes...why does Racetrack have 8...

That was before they stripped stuff from Pegasus.

Cavil. Fuck no he kills himself. That was harder to believe than "God did It all"

Hardest part for me too.

Ive been thinking about it all day, and despite the overblown mysticism, religion stuff, I am thinking a lot about the Simak/LeGuin/Chad Oliver inspired stuff at the end about the building of the new society. Very subtle, just the way it should have been.

[Liege-Killer]

I keep wondering what happens during that 150K years. That's too early for innovations like agriculture, which was only discovered.... what, 10K years ago? 20K? I think there's probably a short renaissance period there with the colonials and cylons, but as they mingle with the more stupid natives, all their knowledge is lost and there is a sort of Dark Ages.

I'm also wondering if they expect us to believe that names like Hera, Apollo, Athena endured as myths through that entire time, eventually landing in Greece? Cute idea, but ridiculous.

a lot of people think the whole "God did it" was too much of a cop-out.

Sure it's a cop-out. Which is why I reject all the supernatural nonsense and prefer to look at it in a different way. "God" was really an extremely ancient, extremely advanced, benevolent alien being (species?) lending a guiding hand to humanity and the cylons, trying to help them avoid the mistakes it has seen countless times throughout history. It was responsible for the opera house and all the other visions. Head-Six and Head-Baltar were its agents, and Starbuck was also a very special type of agent, even though she didn't know it until the end. Probably this being contrived to bring Hera together with the natives on "Earth" because of some unique trait of their combined genetics, something that would give them a better chance at long-term survival.

That's my interpretation, and Moore & Co. can stuff their gods and angels where the sun doesn't shine.

[Rakis]

I keep thinking that the entire "angel" thingy was their way to do the Beings of Light from the original series...

[Ampoliros]

I still like my Culture Idea. even if it's a human civilization, one that can do the things that the head people did would appear as magic/religious mysticism to people of even Galactica's tech level. Diplomatically, it would be in their best interest to allow the people to think whatever they wanted, god, aliens beaming their mind control through tv or wireless, whatever. Their job is to keep humanity going. Anytime one outpost gets too crazy and about to nuke itself, they step in with a couple manipulations and set it straight. they can't do everything, so when things get real bad they try at least to set people on the proper course. Obviously they value machine life as much as human life.

I would like more info on Kobol, but I think the mystery adds a bit to it. In the end I don't feel like the God Did it was so much of a cop out as to ruin the ending, I just wish we had gotten more development with each character's ending. 45 mins was not enough. I really feel like they wasted a lot of season 4.5 on things they would have skipped even in season 2.

[GamePlayer]

Just finished up the last episode. I know, I'm slightly behind, but you all know me and the fact that I don't watch TV. I have to catch everything on my schedule, so I'm never totally up to date

I can't say much right now (bed time!) except that it was the strong finale that I was hoping for. I'll post more soon, but for now, I'll sleep on it and enjoy the moment. What a series!

[Rakis]

I would like more info on Kobol, but I think the mystery adds a bit to it. In the end I don't feel like the God Did it was so much of a cop out as to ruin the ending, I just wish we had gotten more development with each character's ending. 45 mins was not enough. I really feel like they wasted a lot of season 4.5 on things they would have skipped even in season 2.

Agreed about the waste of time in the last season...that makes me think we could have seen the end last year, but they milked it a little bit...

A new series about Kobol would be cool, or at least a movie...

[Mandy]

http://www.theonion.com/content/news/ob ... =a-section

Obama told aides he feels "like a cylon without a Resurrection Ship."

[Freakzilla]

http://www.theonion.com/content/news/obama_depressed_distant_since?utm_source=a-section

Obama told aides he feels "like a cylon without a Resurrection Ship."

Does that mean he realizes there's no chance in hell of getting re-elected?

[SandRider]

[Ampoliros]

Poor Freak, Obama already has the next 4 years in the bag, and then Michelle for 8 more after him.

[Mandy]

Is it really such a big deal that she put her arm around the Queen?

[Omphalos]

Is it really such a big deal that she put her arm around the Queen?

Seems to be.

[SandRider]

it looked to me like the Queen touched first ....

[Seraphan]

Yeah i know i'm extremely late for the party, but what the heck, i feel like saying something about it now.
The idea of them landing on earth and mingle with the primitives, indicating that much of the culture that evolved was thanks to them, really isnt my cup of tea. It's the kind of stuff a lot of loonies take for real.
Hera's role was, well dissapointing. And the entire scene where Kavol blows his brains out is beyond rediculous.
All in all, good and strong emotional scenes but i'm with SandRider, if you're going to write a big complex plot, figure it all out before you start. They developed a lot of good ideas but it's like juggling 10 plates at the same time, it's very pretty but your going to end up with porcelain bits stuck in yout face.

PS: How much of a possibility it is that Kara's father is the artistic cylon Kavol killed? The one Ellen talked about.

[SandRider]

none.

I don't think those jackasses realized they'd forgotten a "Number 7"
until the third season or so, and only then because those morons on
the BSG board finally noticed it.

[Mandy]

There's an article somewhere about the 7th cylon, I think RM explained what happened.

[Rakis]

When is The Plan coming up?

[SandRider]

There's an article somewhere about the 7th cylon, I think RM explained what happened.

"explained" or "pulled something out of his ass to make the fans STFU ?"

[Seraphan]

It's one of those things where you had an initial idea but have no way to elaborate or explain it. Just pretend it's mystery and you know the answer.
It was an awsome show but i wonder how this will affect future sci-fi tv shows. I wonder this because when Alan Moore wrote Watchmen almost every other comic that has come out since has tried imitate it and failed massively.

[Mandy]

Here's RM's explanation http://www.airlockalpha.com/node/6075

Basically the story changed as the show went along and they needed to do some retcon. This is how the story of Cavil wiping out all the Daniels came about. They'd already given Sharon the number 8 and it was too late to change.

I hope BSG has a positive effect on future sci fi. I'm a bit tired of all the silly shows, where the good guys are always on their best behavior and the bad guys are always super bad. I don't care how advanced our civilization becomes, people are still going to be shades of gray.

[SandRider]

the stuff that's been on SciFi (or SyFy) (*Sigh* Fie!)
lately has just sucked Cartman's balls.

Warehouse 13 or whatever is bad. Now, I only watched about
a half hour of one show, but then I only read a few pages of
House Atreides, too.

the 'original' movies are really, really bad.

have y'all seen the one about "Marines" in Afghanistan fighting sandworms ?

[Omphalos]

Missed that one. Though I did watch the one about the four or five hotties that were accidentally teleported to the center of the earth where there was sunlight and dinosaurs, just like in Burroughs. And I watched exactly 50 (five - zero) seconds of "The Terminators. That was probably the worst piece of crap they have ever made.

One of those women on Warehouse 13 has a serious Zoey Deschannel thing going on. Yowza!

[SandRider]

finally got around to reading the link Nipples posted -
don't know that Moore explained anything to me, except
"we make this shit up as we go along", which I already knew.

but, while perusing this site :

"'Warehouse 13' Now Most-Watched Syfy Show In History"

http://www.airlockalpha.com/node/6678



hey ! people are simple & easily entertained !

[Mandy]

All TV shows make stuff up as they go along. They kinda have to, because they don't know if they'll get renewed.

[SandRider]

sure, in a open-ended episodic series - like some cop-drama bullshit,
just kill somebody else in the opening scene. if you want a story-arc
over a few episodes, give the gruff detective AIDS and the young
handsome cop's wife cancer, or whatever.

BSG had an endpoint - find earth. (or don't).
The Cylons had a backstory - it should have been thought out,
atleast in broad terms, from the beginning. And maybe it was,
maybe if the first season hadn't been so damn good and popular,
they would have tied everything up in a way that made sense.

maybe the success of the show was it's ultimate un-doing.

I don't know, as time goes by and it sinks in a little deeper, I'm
leaning toward "Fail" on BSG overall. But I've got all but the last
part on DVD, and the last ones are still on the DVR, I've been
contemplating watching the whole damn thing again - but I think
that will suck, too, because I can't unsee the ending.

I keep thinking my standards are too high - then I'll see something
on IFC like "Waking Life" and think, nah, all you other people just
ain't trying very hard ...

[SandChigger]

Siffy is just complete bullshit.



I'm back, at Base Station One for another while, from my holiday travels and I've had Siffy on since I got in. Some crap show called "Joan of Arcadia". About the only good thing is the opening theme song, a slightly reworked version of Joan Osborne's "What if God was one of us?"

Haven't seen any of "Warehouse 13" yet. Have watched more than a few episodes of Siffy's "Ghost Hunters" ... a bit better than History Channel's "UFO Hunters". Gonna watch it and "Destination: Truth" tonight.

While I was at my friends' place over in Dayton, we watched the six episodes of the first season of a series called "being human" on BBC America On Demand. Essentially a horror fantasy, about a vampire, werewolf, and ghost bint shacking up in a flat and trying to pass as humans. Entertainingly watchable.

[Mandy]

I think the main problem with BSG was network interference. They wanted more standalone episodes so casual/first time viewers could tune in and not be lost. All the standalone episodes were pretty shitty, imo.. brought the whole series down.

I watched Warehouse 13 once, not very interesting, too cheesy. I think they're trying to imitate Sanctuary, but with objects instead of creatures.

[Seraphan]

I like ghost hunters, mainly because of the debunking attitude they have. I recomend the fourth season.

[SandChigger]

I like ghost hunters, mainly because of the debunking attitude they have. I recomend the fourth season.

I think that's why I like the show, too. With "UFO Hunters" it's too obvious that they're all True Believers, and the rigor of the "research" suffers. If the ghost hunters don't find anything, they say so and don't whitewash it.

The only thing that has put me off even slightly was one episode where the young tatted guy commanded any ghosts to speak "in the name of Jesus Christ." I hadn't heard him do that before.

Watched "Destination Truth" (AKA "The Blare Truth Project"?) and was impressed no so much.

[Seraphan]

The only thing that has put me off even slightly was one episode where the young tatted guy commanded any ghosts to speak "in the name of Jesus Christ." I hadn't heard him do that before.

They sometimes say stuff like that to try and get a reaction, the only one i know is religious is Donna, the case manager.
The one big complaint i have about the show is the music they put, it's trying to affect the viewers and for a show that tries to look out for facts, i think that's wrong. But still, at least they dont go around and say "hey that's a ghost!" like all the other stuff i've seen on tv.

[SandChigger]

Continuing off-topic...

I've seen two or three "Destination Truth" episodes now, and it's seemed like every one has had an "Eeek! Run!" moment. When they pulled it again over a snake (while searching in the jungles of the Yucatan for vampire pigmies), I just changed the channel.

[A Thing of Eternity]

Well, took me long enough but I finally finished watching my favourite show. There were some issues with it as mentioned in the last couple pages of this thread, but it did it for me. It was a better ending than I'd expected, though I would have cut the whole NY ending, WAAAAY too on-the-nose, I think even an idiot could have figured out that they were implying everything that was said/shown in that scene just by the fact that they were on our Earth.

Final battle was epic, dead-rapter-nuke thing was dumb, but didn't really do any major damage to the scene. Nowhere near as epic as the storming of New Caprica IMO, which was probably one of the most badassed fights in SF history.

The Hera plot line could have been tied in better. Though I could say that her existing did lead them to that final battle, and without that battle Cara never would have punched those coordinates into the FTL system, so she did serve a purpose.

I can't see how any SF show in history or the near future has/will come even into the same league as this show.

[SandChigger]

Are there even ANY SF shows on now?

FlashBoredward tanked after one season. Did V vrooom off as well? What's on now?

[Omphalos]

No, but there are a few starting up here soon. Cant remember any of the titles, but Ive seen ads for a few, and one (The Event, IIRC) I think Im gonna give a try.

Plus in October The Walking Dead starts up. Watch or Die!

[TheDukester]

I can't see how any SF show in history or the near future has/will come even into the same league as this show.

Mini-series, seasons 1 and 2 = in the top five or 10 shows ever put on television.

Seasons 3, 4 = not in the top 500.

Ending = insulting, nonsensical, borderline retarded. I would pay good money to scrub it from my brain forever, if such technology existed.

Opinions ... fun, ain't they?

[A Thing of Eternity]

Indeed. I liked season 4 more than season 3 in some ways, 3 was just too much obvious winging it with the storyline and reconning (season 4's retconning was much more sucessful IMO).

I'll easily agree that the first 2 seasons were the best. I actually liked most of the last 2 seasons, I just didn't dig the "final 5" business very much.

I wish they'd cut the final scene of the last episode, we all got it, didn't need to be that obvious. Hell, if I'd been writing it I would have had them get to Earth and then just cut it off, leave people saying "what the fuck?". It wasn't as good as I'd hoped for, but it was better than I'd expected.

I liked the resolution of Starbuck's story arc though.

The thing is, that even the relative weakness of the last 2 seasons was still better than pretty much everything else SF that's ever been on TV.

[Omphalos]

The two things that bothered me about the series were 1) the half-assedness of the resolution (after the first few seasons they just kind of picked a way to go without too much thought, then did it) and 2) the depths of Kara Thraces' psychosis (it just had to get worse and worse). Other than those two things I loved the show, and I personally loved the anthropological bits at the very end.

[A Thing of Eternity]

I'll agree that a lot of the end was half assed, but I think the half-assing happened during season 3 and then they were just fucked. From then on they seemed to do their best to undo the damage, with mixed results.

What part of Kara's craziness bugged you? Seemed pretty reasonable to me for someone slowly finding out that they're a ghost. Was it the piano bit? I'll have to re-watch that, I was pretty sure by the end of it that the piano player was a figment of her imagination (dead father but younger).

I liked the piano bit, but may have been biased by how utterly incredible that Bob Dylan cover is. The guy who did all the music for BSG is amazing, I hope they put out a soundtrack (... or have they already... must google this now).

[Omphalos]

The whole time she was in that garbage scow, when Felix's leg got shot off. That was some terrible, terrible overacting on her part. And the few episodes leading up to it. Like when she was lying down on the floor, screaming "You're going the wrong way!" I so wanted to put that bitch into time-out when I saw that.

[A Thing of Eternity]

Ok, you're going further back than I was thinking. I can see that bugging you, I'll have to rewatch it though.

[SandRider]

I liked the piano bit, but may have been biased by how utterly incredible that Bob Dylan cover is. The guy who did all the music for BSG is amazing, I hope they put out a soundtrack (... or have they already... must google this now).

do you have the DVDs ?

in one of the sets, don't know which one w/o getting up to look,
there's a long DVD extra about the music guy .... pretty good,
if I remember right, the guy's a little loopy - there's an overplayed
joke about him not being around - all the actors have clips saying
"the guy who does the music ? never seen him" & "there's no one
'guy' I think, it's all computer-generated" & "we have music on this show ?"

[A Thing of Eternity]

I only have the first 2 seasons on DVD, there's something on him in there, but I did rent DVDs for the last seasons, there is a very extensive bit on how he works in the first disk of season 4.5, and I think a good one of him working on that cover tune in season 3.

He's seriously amazing. I'm not sure if people realize how difficult it is to combine those eastern instruments with western instruments - most of the time you hear stuff like that they are mangling the eastern instruments into our note system, or just plain making our instruments sound eastern (like putting a sitar effect on a guitar rather than using a real one).

The way he does it (using their real note systems on top of ours) involves very seriously complicated math and intuition/experience. If I tried to do what he does it might take me months of hard work just to do one song and not have it sound out of tune.

[Omphalos]

I liked the piano bit, but may have been biased by how utterly incredible that Bob Dylan cover is. The guy who did all the music for BSG is amazing, I hope they put out a soundtrack (... or have they already... must google this now).

do you have the DVDs ?

in one of the sets, don't know which one w/o getting up to look,
there's a long DVD extra about the music guy .... pretty good,
if I remember right, the guy's a little loopy - there's an overplayed
joke about him not being around - all the actors have clips saying
"the guy who does the music ? never seen him" & "there's no one
'guy' I think, it's all computer-generated" & "we have music on this show ?"

Bear McReady. I think its on season 4

[A Thing of Eternity]

Sweet, I found out they have sound tracks for all the series available and the movies. I'm going for the one with Watch Tower first, then I'll get the rest as time goes by.

I really liked how he insisted on live musicians too, a lot of the stuff they did (mainly the drumming) could have easily been sequenced, but doing it with a real musician gives it a lot nicer feel.

[Robspierre]

I have all four season soundtracks. Lots of good stuff. Excellent writing listening.

Rob

[A Thing of Eternity]

I have all four season soundtracks. Lots of good stuff. Excellent writing listening.

Rob

That's exactly what I was thinking, I always to find good instrumental stuff to listen to while writing (languages I don't understand works too), this would be perfect.

[TheDukester]

(McCreary)

Also, "All Along The Watchtower" is credited to a group called BT4, not the composer. I don't know anything about the group other than that.

I thought that song was undoubtedly the highlight of Season 3, which is funny on two levels: 1. It occurred in literally the last three minutes of the season; 2. It had nothing to do with the acting, directing, scripting, etc. By that point, I was recording the show and watching it like 10 days later ... and extending my middle finger toward the TV.

That whole "Guess Who Is A Cylon!" thing still makes me cringe. It's like Anderjacket wrote that season.

[A Thing of Eternity]

I'll have to dig into that group, but I remember it being the composer's brother singing it or something like that, so I'll be he wrote it in collaberation with some other people, thus didn't take full cred for himself.

[Himachil]

The BSG soundtracks are fantastic - well worth a gander.

[Mandy]

All Along the Watchtower was composed by Bear and performed by his brother Brendan (aka Bt4).

Some of Brendan's stuff is on youtube.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ka_sHy9cVH0

http://www.youtube.com/user/BrEndAnsBand

[TheDukester]

Ah, interesting. I thought that there was a group by that name that was invited to make a guest appearance. Great song, either way (you'd think it might be the cheesiest thing ever, but they really pulled it off).

[A Thing of Eternity]

It sends shivers down my spine, and as a composer of sorts I'm continually blown away by his ability to meld eastern and western note systems (it should sound completely out of tune, most notes in a given scale are off by enough to sound like shit when you compare east to west, combining the two requires very very carefull planning of which notes from which system are played over eachother at which times - it's seriously a feat).